EJ Guide – Cata Unholy’s Up

The title should be self-explanatory: I went ahead and posted the Cataclysm version of my Elitist Jerks Unholy DK dps guide. It’s viewable here, for those interested.

It’s still somewhat of a work in progress, but it should be more than sufficient for the time being, and it will obviously fill out and be refined between now and the release of Cataclysm (and continuing thereafter). Besides, even in it’s “fresh” state, it still blows most of the similar posts on EJ out of the water, if I do say so myself!

Besides, if this is how complete it is two months before the expansion even hits, just imagine how it will be two or twelve or twenty months after! Modesty aside, I’m quite pleased with it, especially since I pushed it out from scratch in about 24 hours.


83 Responses to EJ Guide – Cata Unholy’s Up

  1. Baphomette says:

    Thanks as always for your efforts keeping people informed.

    Can a consolidated DPS writeup for both Frost and Unholy be far behind? 😉

    • Consider says:

      I still haven’t looked into what’s up with the Frost thread yet, nor have I made up my mind as to what I would do depending on the answer to that. Tough decision. We’ll see!

      • Seamus says:

        Please provide one. Your template is awesome and you could advertise for someone to take it over.

        As much as I like Unholy, Frost is a good deal of fun and I’d like some help maximizing the spec.

  2. Gravity says:

    Holy crap. That’s impressive for a 4.01 OP.

  3. Leviatharan says:

    Just noticed this playing on the PTR (tried self-healing and was sad to see the HoT’s gone, but…)
    I think Lifeblood’s not utterly worthless to DPS anymore.

    • Consider says:

      Oh, very nice. That would put it above all professions but the holy trinity that is BS, JC, and Engineering. Quite nice.

      I haven’t actually updated the professions section, hence the WIP tag, but that will obviously be hugely important to note once I do.

      • Leviatharan says:

        Skinning, Tailoring, and Mining have had their bonuses doubled too. Could be significant… except for Mining, since it’s still kinda worthless.

      • Consider says:

        Pretty much every profession has had their self-bonus tweaked. The engineering glove enchant was nerfed a bit, but now they have their new unique gems. Alchemy obviously gets a huge boost from the flask being strength instead of ap. All that you mentioned. So on! It flips things up quite a bit. I’ll probably redo the section tomorrow if I have time, although it’s not that urgent, in my opinion.. As it stands, BS/JC/Engi do ultimately still win though, and that’s largely because of their customizability – Pretty much all of the professions give the same amount of stats over time (herblism, for example, averages out to 40 haste, which is the same ‘budget’ as most of the other professions), so all else equal, being able to choose the most optimal stat is ultimately the winner. That, and utility (in the case of Engineering).

  4. Azerius says:

    you know, i think this is about the right time to thank you for all the work you put into maximising the DK class so that others don’t have too.
    From one who has used your information since pretty much as long as its been around (not blindly, ALWAYS verify things yourself :P)…

  5. ODK says:

    So Condider, Refering to your Enchant section on EJ for 4.0

    Wouldnt the 15Str enchant to gloves be better than 20 hit? i know you get an additional 5 hit that way, but your allways gona be hit capped, so your basically gaining 20 Haste – doesnt 15 Str beat 20 Haste?

    • Consider says:

      You’re right, up until the part where you ask if 15 str beats 20 haste! It does not; not on live, and certainly not on beta.

      • ODK says:

        hehe so far haste has gotten me in ALOT of trouble on beta, 13% on gear +IUP hehe….. im curious, do you feel like you have to sit on your hands for tanks to keep threat or can you go all out without pulling threat? So far ive had mostly pugs and not many tanks have been able to hold threat, i get yelled at alot to chill out, that DK’s are overpowered atm….chains of ice is doing a hellova job tho heh… i should also mention that yes im useing focus-target to make sure im attacking the npc the tank is focus’d on as well as nameplates to see health values…

        cant wait to see stat values…..

  6. Clev says:

    a question, aoe avoidance for the ghoul is gone for or they have plan to give it back with cata? I can’t find blues on this argument.

    • Jonneh says:

      I couldnt find a post, but some classes still have it where as some lost it when talents got changed afaik so, its still up in the air.

    • Time says:

      If I remember reading correctly, AoE avoidance is still there for PvE but missing for PvP. It just doesn’t show up as a pet passive ability.

      • Consider says:

        It is not currently there for PvE. Pet dies quite fast in heroic 85s! I assume it’s just an oversight, but you know what they say about assuming, so I’m just going to stick to working off the present reality.

      • Time says:

        Hmm, interesting. Just pulled up some AoE from the dragons near Grim Batol and got.

        Twilight Wrymkiller’s Twilight Flame Breath hits Jesuit for 3100 Shadow.
        Twilight Wrymkiller’s Twilight Flame Breath hits Gravethief for 310 Shadow.

        Karsh Steelbender’s add voidzone from Blackrock Caverns is also seeing an AoE reduction. Maybe some AoE spells are being considered single target.

      • Consider says:

        Unless they ninja-changed it in the very last build (which would be great news if they did), I still have parses from a patch ago where he definitely was taking full damage throughout heroic BRC (among others) from AoEs. Not that I don’t believe you, but mind throwing up a parse/screenshot/whatever? Can’t get on to test it myself, atm.

        ((I assume by void zones, you mean lava zones?))

      • Time says:

        Should have been resolved 2 builds ago. There might be single target abilities that are splashing AoE and avoiding the reduction. It would be interesting to know which are.

  7. xtatik says:

    Bah… I hadn’t even thought about Unholy Frenzy being an enrage before. They need to change that IMO. I like having the option to be able to buff someone else with it if I want to, but right now it is essentially just a Fury Warrior talent that they accidentally left in Unholy.

    • poiso says:

      Unholy Frenzy is essentially renamed and reworked Hysteria. Hysteria has always been an enrage.

      • xtatik says:

        I understand that. I’ve just always taken the fact that it’s an enrage for granted and have never thought about the consequences of that and the Fury mastery before reading new 4.0 thread.

      • ODK says:

        what consequences are you refering to xtatik?

      • Sag says:

        He is referring to getting a “buff” that you’ll most likely never use one yourself because it affects another class spec combo more than yours. Would it be OP if they made a glyph to give you a mini enrage similar to the way the innervate glyph works? So every time you case UHFren on someone else you deal an additional damage equal to 20% of their damage during the enrage? Something like that?

      • ODK says:

        i still dont quite understand how a buff is a consequence? donno if im just reading things wrong but that just confused me more…

  8. Time says:

    Would it be possible, in the FAQ section, to add why Runic Corruption is mandatory for the spec? How much of a damage loss is it to not take RC? Just a side by side comparison for those who might ever feel the need to use those 2 point investments elsewhere to pick up some extra utility. Or if other talents should be sacrificed over RC.

  9. shylock says:

    Could you post an explanation of how best to work bloodtap into the rotation? Didnt see it mentioned in the guide.


    • Consider says:

      That’s probably the sort of thing I’ll address in the FAQ section. Generally speaking, there’s not much to its use. The Blood Tap bug which still exists isn’t of much important to Unholy with Festering working how it does.

  10. Magdalena of Turalyon says:

    I’ve actually been wondering about those of us using Rune Strike macros- I’m assuming 4.0.1 heralds the end of these completely? Anyone tried testing them out?

    Here’s the one I’m currently using for Scourge Strike (replace strike name with any other ability you want):

    #showtooltip Scourge Strike
    /script UIErrorsFrame:UnregisterEvent(“UI_ERROR_MESSAGE”);
    /cast Scourge Strike;
    /cast !Rune Strike;
    /script UIErrorsFrame:RegisterEvent(“UI_ERROR_MESSAGE”);

    • Keebzz says:

      That is correct, Magdalena. Rune Strike is on the GCD so you will be unable to macro it to your other strikes hoping to get them both off (provided you just dodged/parried of course).

      I haven’t tested it, but logic dictates that is what will happen with the current functionality of Rune Strike. Another thing to keep in mind is that you will likely not want to expend Runic Power on Rune Strike as opposed to Death Coil which has it’s own benefits for Unholy.

      Also, say it wasn’t on the GCD and you could bind it to all your strikes, then it would be incredibly powerful for Frost, Blood, and RE-Unholy (skipped Runic Corruption) as it is tied to Runic Empowerment and would lead to more Rune Strikes being used, thus refreshing more runes on average. Again, to emphasize, this is assuming you are dodging/parrying consistently (harder as non-Blood), and that Rune Strike was changed to be off the GCD.

      Also to Consider —
      First time poster here (tank actually!), just wanted to say thanks for all the posts — great work here, on EJ, and always great to see you posting over at Pwnwear.

      • Magdalena of Turalyon says:

        Thanks for that, I vaguely remember reading that Rune Strike had been changed to work on the GCD, but wasn’t sure..
        As it is, the only noticeable difference it currently makes in raid bosses (invaluable when soloing) is during Lord Marrowgar, and that too, isn’t a massive increase.

      • ODK says:

        Sorry for the Offtopic question…but we need more tanks in game badly heh…
        So wheres the resourecs for DK Tanks in Beta/Cata? the queue is killing me and lack of quality tanks even worse, tried it on my own without any direction and feel extreemly resource starved but not sure if im even useing the right set of skills…. id run out of runes and taunts and still have stuff everywhere free…..but also i never played blood in wrath either so its all foreign….

      • Sag says:

        There are a few thread written at http://www.pwnwear.com addressing DK tanking issues. They seem to echo your remarks about never having what you need/want. I have yet to check their forums, but I believe that you’ll be able to find an animated thread discussion there on the topic you are looking for.

  11. Kin says:

    I’m excited to see Alchemy so high on the profession list! Makes me feel good to know I have a profession that’s getting a sweet mount and is moderately competitive xD

  12. Mysiana says:

    Amazing OP over on EJ, Consider. I just love being a DK because we actually have posters like yourself that are very passionate about the class and keeping us informed. I never knew how truly good we had it until I tried to look up information for a new alt of mine – boy was I unimpressed. Keep up the good work!

    • Zeran says:

      Yeah, being an unholy dk, I went to EJ and all the information I needed was right there. I tried that for my rogue and pally alts, and it took me hours of reading to feel like I had a grasp on what I needed to know (not to insult the authors of those threads bas their work is invaluable, but their format could use a bit of work). So once again, thanks Consider.

  13. Shrak says:

    Great job on that OP, as always ! Do you know if anything similar is planned for frost over on EJ and if so, who would be doing it ?

  14. Minaka says:

    Hey Consider, not sure if anyone else has seen this yet, but Ghostcrawler over at http://blue.mmo-champion.com/t/27026377083/dk-tanking-one-thing-we-need/ says that Rune Strike will be useable all the time, as long as we’re in Blood Presence.

    • Consider says:

      Yeah, I’ve seen it. Incredible change for Blood and tanking. Solves most of the rotational issues there. All that remains are some minor annoyances, such as SF being tied to BB and SoB being awkward in general, but otherwise, they’re pretty well off now. RE is still RE, but what can you do. Happy for tanks. Woo hoo.

      Frost’s turn next?

      • Minaka says:

        I hope so, Frost is my spec of choice.

      • Here’s hoping for some Tiers 1 & 2 changes in Frost. How I wish they’d move that DW’ing talent down into Tier 2 and bump up On A Pale Horse and Lichborne to Tier 1. At least OAPH.

        There’s absolutely no reason for Nerves of Cold Steel to be in Tier 1. They don’t want UH using it, they don’t want Blood using it. I’m not even sure I know why it’s in either of the tiers that the non-DW’ing spec’s use, but at the very least it needs to be in Tier 2. It’s not like any DK will ever be level 1 where they’d have to go without having made it most of the way through the tree, except in the starting area (which is a joke).

        Of course, that’s ignoring the fact that the DW’ing talents could be moved toward the end of the tree, could be merged into one choice at the end (akin to Fury warriors’ choice), or NoCS could be put at the end with both of the talents at the end of the Frost tree (Threat of Thassarian vs Might of the Frozen Wastes) instead being made base. That is, you can’t be confused by the choice because like Feral, if you do one thing (dw) you get one thing and if you do another (2h) you get another. As with Feral having either a mastery that helps Savagery if they’re in bear form or bleeds if they’re in cat form.

        That’d free Frost up to have a couple more cool talents. Perhaps a little something-something to give them some flavor. Like something that makes their temp ghoul more interesting and frosty, perhaps emphasizing the temporary nature of a Frost DK’s ghoul versus the permanent, beloved transforming of the UH ones.

      • Jonneh says:

        Still a lot more deeper issues really with the design if you ask me, but as said above that’s a great change for tanks.

        I guess that also means nerfing the threat RS does though, don’t forget that atm its a powerhouse of threat modifiers. I doubt it could stay at its current level as a spamable ability. Totally replacing DC on the bar is a nice little bonus though for bar space ^_^ (DC will still be useful in some cases ofc, ranged threat is never useless, but you can macro them together with a modifier)

        I also worry more than a little about the pvp balance of the change. I said before now that I literally 2 shot a ret pally with a high RS crit once in a duel, and it really does hit hard when it crits. I have no idea how and/or if its damage has been changed in cata, but its worth mentioning that perhaps someone should check out its potential use by putting on dps/pvp gear and seeing how much it hits for. I would imagine a crit on cloth could be quite nasty if the damage is the same…

  15. Andeus says:

    First of all thanks for the guide. Just read it and looks great.

    Got a (possibly silly) question though
    You say:
    Diseases > Dark Transformation > SS if both Unholy and/or all Death runes are up > FeS if both pairs of Blood and Frost runes are up >

    So if I understand it correctly we wait to have at least 2 UH / 1UH + 1DR / 2 DR to start using SS?
    Likewise we wait for 2 BF + 2 FR to go up before we start FeS?

    If so, could someone explain to me why not use it the second the UH (or BFR for FeS) rune pops up ? What am I missing about the new system?

    • Consider says:

      No, you don’t start using SS then, you prioritize using SS then.

      If you have both Unholy runes up (or all of your 4 Death Runes up), you want to SS asap so you’re not sitting on runes, just as on live. Similarly, if you have both pairs of BF runes up, you want to FeS. This doesn’t mean you wait until then to use those abilities, it just means that if you reach that point of time and haven’t used those abilities, then you need to prioritize them above all else (sans diseases/DT, of course).

      You can, and in many cases will, certainly use SS/FeS as soon as one of their relevant rune costs pops up. It’s just that DCing then often takes precedent due to stacking SI or proccing RC, because you don’t lose anything by holding off on SS/FeS… until you reach the point where both runes of a type are up, which is why you then prioritize SS/FeS.

      If that makes any sense.

      • Andeus says:

        Actually it does. It was the “both BFR” part (aka 4 runes up) that got me confused since in all my time on the PTR I never got more than 3 runes up at any given moment, but that’s what the new system is supposed to do anyway. Now that you clarified it, i get that by making sure your DC procs are used effectively you might lag behind a bit on rune usage and eventually get to a point of having 4 of them up.

        In a scenario where you have 1 UH, 1 BR, 1FR ready does it matter whether you’ll go FeS or SS first? Maybe FeS to proc 2 DR earlier for 2 SS or is it the same result in the long run?

      • Consider says:

        Same result in the long run. SS tends to be prioritized because it’s more immediate damage, but unless the fight is ending in a second (or you’re going to have to run out of melee range or what have you), it really won’t matter.

  16. Jonneh says:

    As an aside, I’m not sure of the wisdom in a design that has our pet doing SO much damage compared to other stuff.

    Don’t get me wrong, I love DT and the way its worked out for us.. but pet doing more damage than our own white swings? More damage than everything except SS? Insane balancing. We are the new BM hunters.

    I worry about mechanics like BQ where we will be shunned because the 100% damage buff doesn’t apply to the damage our pet does, unless the new pet mechanics also ensure buffs like that do travel to the pet? (has anyone tested something like that?)

    Even so, Kologarn anyone? Buggy bosses where pets get stuck or cant attack for some reason. Massive problem for us now, being a ~20% (?) dps loss?

    It also hugely devalues one of our only remaining self heals, making it a huge, huge punishment to use. Better than death obviously, but still a huge dps loss.

    • This is why UH wouldn’t be wrong to get a PVE-centric self-heal that could be spread out over a long period of time and possibly be dispellable. And why in fights where our pet dies due to incidents that are out of our control we will need a way to lower that Raise Dead cd similar to how Warlocks (2nd tier demo, available to all) get a free insta-summon (plus a talent to remove mana cost) for their pet if it dies a freak death and how hunters have access to Phoenix. Plus, both of the other pet specs get access to auto-heals for their pets based on the damage they do.

      Meanwhile, dk’s do not. I think a talent to give death coil a splash heal when used on the target of the ghoul and the ghoul is within 5 yards of the target would not be inappropriate. It would not be as awesome as the heals that hunter pets and lock minions get automatically, but it would help. It would balance out a rather visible disparity. And it’s not like the ghoul is an insignificant amount of the dps of the uh dk.

      Then again, I’m an advocate of having the UH mastery also boost ghoul damage, even if indirectly by having disease damage influence how much damage the ghoul’s special attack does. I feel like this would emphasize the overall theme of the Unholy tree and it would also give them a way to boost UH mastery without worrying about invinci-dots being crazy high in damage.

      To do that, UH dk’s would definitely need the tools that other pet classes get (long cd rare-use insta-summon and a pet dps-based auto-heal) to help keep that pet up and in use.

      This would not address the issue of the pet not working in some fights, but this would otherwise help other parts of UH as a pet spec, which it is.

    • ODK says:

      Our pet may be a huge part of our dps, but i can still pull excellent numbers without him, course if they tune that differently, could quickly be a problem….

      I Highly agree we could use another form of self heal….something similar to Rune Tap would be awsome…

      But when it comes to sac’in the ghoul for health, if the cooldown for the ghoul keeps being when you summon it AND they raise the survivability to what it use to be, you shouldnt have to many times when you need to sac the ghoul where he cant be brought back up immediately….thats basically a 2m cooldown heal, if your ghoul is cooled down by the time you use the heal, then resummon ghoul, then ghoul should nearly be ready for summon by the time the heal is back off cooldown too

      i dont like how deathstrike can only pull in 10% now, i miss the 3 disease 15% and allways forget i can use the new one without the diseases heh…maby they should add another 2.5% healing per disease? then the 75% extra from blood would add to them too…

      hehe maby im just building a OP machine, but i LOVE the class now and can only immagine how fun it could be with a few random other utilities….

      also wish they would just give DK’s on a pale horse speed baseline, doesnt effect combat or anything, dont see any harm in it….with the lack of talent points anymore it hurts to spend on, specially tier 2…unless you want lichborn

  17. Demosthenes says:

    After spending bout an hour on the test dummy, I feel I have a good handle on the rotation. I how was using just lvl 85 premade gear with no glyphs and was sitting around 8.6k for the entire time. I had a few questions about the priority rotation that you have used in EJ post.My damage break down was 26 percent SS, 24 percent melee, and 17 percent death coil. I figured this must be wrong as you had pointed out that ghoul should be number 2 damage source, I then looked, and yes 25 percent of dmg was from ghould. Does this break down with what you were expecting ? It would appear the for all intents and purposes blood strike is useless for us? Another question would be should we horde RP when Dark Transforamation is about to run out so as to try and get about 3 dcs of quicly and maximize its up time. Another question I had would be conerning buffs and festering strike when we add time to current diseases with Festering Strike do they recieve new buff perhaps from 4 piece t11 or any other proced buff we may have recieved? Also had question on Dark Sac, can we use it on friendly players or only hostile entities, this of course harks back to stealing say shadow aura or windfury?

    • ODK says:

      Blood strike comes in handy when you death strike, use up that blood rune when its at double charge and dont have a frost ready…..i dont use it very often atall, but its available on keybind incase…

      occasionally, specially in aoe fights without CC, ill be spammin DS nonstop for survival and either BB or BS to clear the blood….

    • ODK says:

      Forgot to mention, ive found useing your DC’s as you can (with some extra for interrupts left alone) will give you enough runic empowerment, giving you enough extra runes, while in unholy presence burns runes so fast, you can get that runic up so quick…. maby evne faster with the additional rune attacks in there…

      im also curious about festering and mastery bonus too, if you apply disease and then hit a trinket for 1200 mastery rating, does your dot start doing more or does it have to be reapplied?

  18. Daniel says:

    How do you see Unholy dps comparing with DW Frost (which will probably be the alternate dps spec?). Any plans to write a similar guide for Frost?

    • Consider says:

      As it currently stands, Unholy is far superior, but numbers just haven’t been tuned between the two specs. I wouldn’t worry about it yet.

      I did look into the matter, and get word back that Darkside isn’t planning on continuing it, and the mods are cool if I pick it up, so yes, I likely will start a frost thread. Should only take me one solid evening to knock out, but I have stuff going on. Sometime between now and Tuesday.

  19. Anonymous says:

    I’m not in beta.. so what happens of you go in the darkshore whirlpool?

  20. Anonymous says:

    aw ok… I guess its not something that they’ll take out then?

  21. Keith. S says:

    Looks like Rune strike was changed again. Now only usable in Blood Presence but still on GCD.

  22. Lciee says:

    That’s really great news about the frost thread Consider. I’m forced to play frost for the haste buff as we don’t run with an enh shaman so getting some quality theorycrafting on the small things such as stat weights, gemming and DW vs 2hder is excellent.

  23. Jonneh says:

    I cant find an up to date list on what classes/specs provide what buffs so, you could do a blog on that? 😀

    Or glyphs :\ I guess!

    • Consider says:


      Glyph wise, there’s much to say as we have no real major choices, only 3 prime, and then minors aren’t that exciting.

      Hopefully a new beta build hits soon, or something, because there just isn’t much to say right now! A lot of things I could delve into are kinda already out there with the unholy EJ post now up (of which I only really have the FAQ and macro/mods section up, neither of which are terrible interesting nor time intensive). Like I said, it took a couple days for a response, but I did get the clear from Darkside, Tehax (mod who also happens to be a DK, for those unfamiliar), and others to do the Frost thread, but I don’t know if Frozen is doing it now or what? I could discuss Frost related stuff regardless. Or I could compare Frost/Unholy – why spec one over the other, if dps were theoretically equal. Kinda dull though.

      Or perhaps I could turn some focus to DK-independent issues. Just write some stuff about guilds, having been an officer/raid leader in a past one, or what it’s like to be in a top guild, or how to successfully apply to wherever. Or maybe something about my thoughts on how heroics and the initial level 85 gearing process is shaping up. Or who knows. Stuff of that vein. I do plan to do a blog entry before Cataclysm on an initial gearing guide of sorts for when you first hit 85 – not a BiS lists (although I will be doing non heroic, non raid, non -hard mode, and hard mode equivalents) – but more what reps you want to start grinding asap, what dungeons are most beneficial to run, what quests to make sure you don’t miss, whatever, but it’s still too early to do that.

      And now I’m rambling and any semblance of eloquence or intelligence is becoming lost.

      I’m off to sleep!

      • Jonneh says:

        You are my hero, thank god!

        My googling obviously fails somehow, I only found the old thread on pwnwear.

        I would enjoy a bit more general topics for a while. Like you say, we’ve flogged most things to death atm. Stuff about what reps to do and what gear to aim for is a good start in that regard!

      • Sag says:

        I’d love to know what I need to start a heroic as both DPS and tank. When Wrath started it was getting that def cap, and you were pretty much gtg. With DPS I think my biggest goal was getting hit capped, but I tanked a lot more at the start before the tanking situation in my guild sorted things out.

      • Jonneh says:

        Less severe for tanks at a guess, but more needed overall for everyone.

        With cap JPs you can pick up alot of the blue set right off the bat so, I’d guess so long as you do that you’d be alright.

      • Jonneh says:

        Could just do a round up of remaining issues for unholy too, I know it feels like flogging a dead horse but if people can focus feedback around the remaining issues its more likely to get noticed. Frost is still action packed with GCD problems, but unholy is down to just a number of minor things..

        Garg meleeing…. needing ‘waste’ a point in t2 talents to get down any further, even though the utility there is largely useless.

        The complete lack of fun utility is probably just going to get ignored. AMZ is too point intensive, everything else in unholy is boring. Pale Horse is too far away to get 😦

        Maybe even make a few points about how having our pet do so much of our dps kinda puts us in the ‘to be screwed over’ pile when there comes the odd boss with terrible pathing!

        There must be more, but I cant think at the moment. Come to think of it this could probably have much more value and impact as an official forums post anyway.

      • Who else says:

        I nearly see garg as worthless, waste of ghoul empower and 1.5x DC – not so sure if its even worth summoning atm except when you have AMS up soaking and get it off while your bars still fillin up and then its just free food!

        i would rather have on a pale horse than gargoyle, thats how much i find it useless

        i love the garg on live, i still tend to think i have to save it for bosses wasting 1/2+ of its uptime in a raid but when i dont save it and try to time it the raid allways ends up movin faster and it ends up on cooldown anyways, murphys law in effect heh, i hate its use now cause we need our runic for other things more importantly (RC/Empower)

        Really any utility, specifically some CC would be nice, in its place would be great

        Id even take Icy Reach or even everyones favorite Virulance over garg – again not that i dont like garg, its just in the way of everything else right now….doesnt really Fit, make it cost a blood and/or frost rune, i may find use for it then…

  24. Nitey says:

    Consider, you’re the best! 🙂

    One comment on the EJ post: in the BiS table you list to reforge both the trinkets (Crit to Haste), but that seems to be a mistake as there’s no crit rating on either. I suppose you meant it for Shadowmourne?

  25. Anonymous says:

    Another build on Mmo.. only increased thread modifier on blood
    Nothin else interestin QQ

  26. Brandon says:

    Do you have any work on the frost spec or know anywhere that i could find information on it, i would like to see how this will look in cata, but i do like the work on the ej thread

    • Consider says:

      I’ll likely have the thread up tonight, and if not tonight, certainly tomorrow.

      If you have any specific questions regarding it, I would be happy to quickly answer them now, though.

  27. Malaren says:

    Just as a point of clarification – In the Consumables section you removed Flask of Titanic Strength and replaced it with Elixir of Mighty Speed & Elixir of the Naga, but under Professions, you left Flask of Titanic Strength. I know we don’t have weights yet, but are we to assume that if we are an Alchemist, then the Flask outweighs the combo of the two Elixirs?

    • Consider says:

      Mixology affects elixirs, correct? If so, it shouldn’t make any difference. I’ll clear it up this evening.

      I had originally missed the fact that the expertise elixir was a guardian one (which, if you ask me, is a horrible design decision. All melee will be forced to use that and a battle elixir, thus rendering the agi/str flasks near meaningless).

  28. Bermm says:


    Just say this on MMO, is this going to change anything for Frost or Unholy?

    •The way in which runes regenerate has been changed. Rather than each rune type (Blood, Frost, Unholy) regenerating simultaneously, they now fill sequentially. For example, if you use two Blood runes, then the first rune will fill up before the second one starts to fill up. You essentially have three sets of runes filling every 10 seconds instead of six individual runes filling every 10 seconds. This allows the death knight rotation to be more forgiving, so that the player can take advantage of things like ability procs or respond to movement. This system makes it a little easier to get back on track without six separate runes now “out of sync” from the standard rotation.

  29. Malaren says:

    Hey, Consider, will you be updating the Thread Change Log in the Unholy thread? I can tell something was changed b/c you changed the title, but I don’t see anything that says what you changed. =)

    • Consider says:

      I generally only add big updates to the changelog. If I did every moderate sized one… it would be miles long! The latest changes are always someplace up towards the top; the last thing I touched was the bug section, iirc.

  30. Kauket says:

    Wonderful job on getting the these guides up so quickly! I love the sheer usability of the guide’s format (the other writers should imitate).

    That’s all. Can’t really contribute anything to the discussion until I get my unholy butt into a raid. Thanks so much for your efforts!

  31. Khayvén says:

    Consider —

    Love what you’re doing! Thanks!

    I put up a comment regarding spell hit rating on the EJ forums today that ended up getting reported (go figure). The argument I was making was regarding the significance that DC plays in the Unholy rotation now.

    Considering all that DC does:

    SI stacks at every DC;
    DT uptime is increased in frequency due to a lack of miss;
    RC proc chance at every DC;
    Maximizes RP for maximum DPS potential.

    …I have found that an increase of 43 hit (246 up to 289 (spell hit cap with Virulence)) is a DPS increase over the 43 haste counterpart.

    Having every DC hit during an encounter is essential for maximum DPS. Perhaps the compendium could discuss an alternate stat weight for spell hit cap or a mention like was on the old 3.3.x compendium.

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