Musings – End Game

It’s been about a month since I’ve done a blog entry, and although I’ve been occupied with this and that, I certainly haven’t been that busy. If I had something I really wanted to talk about in that time, I could have found the minutes to jot down my thoughts on the subject, I’m sure. Yet, despite the fact that there’s been plenty of material – a patch, a hotfix, the current raiding scene, and so on – from which I could have easily drawn motivation, I haven’t felt the slightest impulse to tackle any of it.

It hasn’t been a matter of laziness so much as utter disinterest.

As of late, the game has just been terribly bland for me. It’s not that the current content is any better or worse than previous tiers (it has its upsides and it has its downsides), nor that this expansion in general has been any more or less than what was promised or expected. It’s just that, well… it’s precisely that, actually! It’s that the current content and the expansion as a whole haven’t been notably changed from the past. It’s the same formula Blizzard has used for the last six years, and although the formula may be brilliant, and although they may regularly stumble upon improvements to it, it’s still what it’s always been when you come down to it.

Now, don’t get me wrong, in some ways, the game is better than ever. Classes are more balanced (although certainly not close to completely so). Rotations are more dynamic (although still rather simple at the core). Raiding is more open (although have fun if you’re too good for normals but not good enough for hards, especially on 10 man). Fixes are faster (although most could still be avoided in beta/PTR, as always). So on and so forth.

By almost any objective measurement, the game has never been stronger. And, even as I write this, I agree wholeheartedly: The game as a whole is at the best it has ever been over its six year lifespan.

And therein lies the issue; as a whole.

If there’s one aspect of the game Blizzard has failed to improve upon in those six years, it’s end game. Don’t get me wrong, as I already said, the raiding is fine. The PvP is, I assume, equally acceptable. But outside those two? What do you have? What do you have that isn’t utterly boring and repetitive, not to mention relatively pointless after a time? What do you do when your guild isn’t raiding? Let me rephrase that: what do you do when your guild isn’t raiding that you actually enjoy?

Dailies? Fun and productive for a time, perhaps, but they grow old quick, and you’ll quickly be rid of the need for their rep/gold/tokens/whatever.

Professions? Once you get to 525, little to do with them aside from make money, and although some enjoy the gold game, I can’t say I do. Professions have probably changed less than any other part of WoW; simply different names to the items/nodes/whatever.

Alts? Enjoyability varies from person to person, but even this process is super fast these days.

Walking around in Stormwind or Ogrimmar? Let’s be honest; for most raiders, this is probably what you spend most of your time outside of instances doing!

Blizzard has failed to provide any meaningful (and, by that, meaning fun) content outside of raiding/arena that you can do more than once and that isn’t the same thing each time you do it. As long as the raiding/arena are good, it’s something most will overlook, but one notices it and tires of it all after a time.

The game is now boring for me because there’s nothing to do. Raid or PvP. Woo hoo.

At any rate, I’ve rambled much more than intended. No, this isn’t an “I’m quitting” post. Most certainly not! I’ll still be playing the game, although all there’s nothing outside of raiding, and even that, I only partake in for the social aspects these days. This is simply my explanation for my lack of postings here and slower-than-usual updates to the EJ threads, and why that trend is likely to continue.

That said, I will try to be better than I have been this patch month or so, though. But posts will be less common than they used to be, and you may notice me being a bit less enthused about it all.

On a couple other notes, which I don’t currently have the time to give their own entry on:

  • Yeah, Unholy got hit again. It should still be slightly ahead of Frost in actual play, although on paper, it might be just about equal. It’s performance relative to other classes is what’s really changed, but there’s nothing one can do about that, and it’s not like the spec is the bottom of the barrel, at any rate.
  • I try not to jump into the EJ threads too often, as I prefer people to figure stuff out for themselves (and as it’s not an “Ask Consider” thread anyways), but try to stay intelligent with the discussions! For your sake as well as mine. Many lackluster posts of late. Bringing up an idea (“get as much hit as possible, yeah!”) is all well and good, and we all know that some of the oddest ideas (Obliterate Unholy? Reapingless? Epidemicless?) have turned out to be the class’s most optimal playstyles. But there’s right ways and wrong ways to go about theories which differ from the accepted norm, and anecdotal evidence (“I seem to have done more dps doing this” or “I was sixth on recount and now I’m one!”) aren’t the way to go. Math. Numbers. Logic. They are your friends. Use them!
  • For those who notice my twitter and have asked: yes, I will be playing Rift. Not 100% sure on the calling yet. I might write up a review of the game during the lull between the open beta and headstart (meaning sometime between tomorrow and Thursday), if there’s interest, be it from others or simply from myself. Many familiar with the game should understand after raiding this post why I’m so attracted to it and find it such a breath of fresh air. Although I don’t expect it to last, say, six years for me as WoW has, as long as I enjoy it for a few months, why not? And, without delving too deeply into the subject: yes, it takes a lot from WoW, and WoW has a lot of good to be taken. And, yes, WoW is probably the better game overall. WoW, however, is also six years old, and thus whatever better aspects it may have one who has been at it from the start will have long grown tired of.

Anyways, I bid you all a good evening!


56 Responses to Musings – End Game

  1. Dascylus says:

    Thank you for ending the stupid discussion of getting over hit cap for DW Frost in such a short and sweet manner… 2-3 weeks of that was enough and I did my best to stay out of it. I noticed a lot of the other big theorycrafters avoided that thread like the plague as well because it would have turned into a huge flamefest.

    Anyway, I hope you enjoy Rift, I really only play WoW for the social aspects of the game, so I don’t see myself moving over to any others because my fiancee and I both communicate long distance through WoW with each other along with out close friends who have moved away.

    As for what I plan to start doing when I’m not raiding or pvping, I’m gonna either farm junk to make bank, or play Bulletstorm on my PS3 to perfect my skill shots.

    • Consider says:

      The social aspect is the one reason why, no matter how boring it may get at times, I would never quit WoW. How much playtime I put into it may ebb and flow pending on the current state of the game, but I could never drop it completely due to the people.

      Rift is more just for “me” time, if you will, although I do know people who will be playing it, and I’m sure if I end up at it for any significant period of time, I would meet others, anyways.

  2. Zumal says:

    Glad to hear from you, Consider. I have to agree with you, although it’s been hard for me to admit. I still enjoy raiding with my friends, however outside of that, I’ve been trying harder to step away from the game. I’ve neglected my consoles for far too long and so instead of playing alts, I’ll play some Marvel vs Capcom 3, for example.

    You said it best: this game is still great at it’s core. Problem is, the core is 6 years old now. Don’t be a stranger – I’d love to hear your thoughts on Rift since I’ve read/heard nothing about it. Do you think you’ll post about Rift in this blog or do I need to read your comments elsewhere?

  3. Jonneh says:

    Couldn’t agree more.

    Path of the titans was cut, and Archaeology totally phoned it in when it came to adding something to the game.

    Cata is more of the same.

    Lets hope for a better 4.1 :/

    • Zibi says:

      That’s not even what this is about. Whether path of the titans worked or not, the end game would still hit a lull because many would still blast through it, or find it boring or some combination of the two, and it would by now be just as boring as it is. It’s like I’ve always told my friends when they ask why I’m burning out, “WoW’s greatest strength is also it’s greatest weakness and that is ‘It’s WoW'”

      • Jonneh says:


        Well, I’m really not sure you can critique the difficulty of this raiding content tier. Its not Gated.. so that sucked unless you were a guild with infinite free time to spend 60 hours a week raiding or w/e.. but besides that it was *ALOT* harder than naxx, and actually had hard modes which are challenging. The first tier is meant to be easy, or at least easier. There is a sharp jump though from normal to heroic. The only really challenging normal is Nef imo. Even then its just one of those fights that’s long so wiping on it feels like a drag because of how long attempts are. Again as Consider says, that punishes groups that can clear normal but struggle with the HCs, but tbh anyone who can’t kill the easy HCs or Nef I dont think should be raiding anyway. Thats just me, I’m mean and prejudice against fail casuals who want to raid ^_^

        The raiding tier can’t really be faulted for not keeping our interest. As Consider says, and I agree, Raiding is still something worth logging in for. Its just all the other stuff which has added absolutely nothing to the game in terms of actual content you can fill the gaps between raid nights with.

        Personally I have been enjoying some RTS gaming in the nights off.

      • crazydodo says:

        I just had to respond to Jonneh’s post even if I dont normally post on most forums/blogs

        I’ve heard people make the same stupid argument that people who can’t clear x shouldn’t raid. As Consider said, there are 2 things you can do endgame, PVP or raid. So if one is not up to your standards and therefore should be banned from raiding in your perfect world then they should either pvp or gtfo right? Guess what, it’s the millions of noobs’ subscriptions that pay for your raiding content so before you shoot your mouth off again, get your head out of your ass and look at the bigger picture.

        There’s a lot more to be said on the subject of raiding, but let’s just say that guilds have become more important than ever in Cata and if you’re unfortunate enough to end up in a slowly decomposing guild and your server’s decent guilds have their ‘no vacancy’ sign on, there really isn’t much of a reason to log on nowadays.

      • Jonneh says:

        My comment was meant more of a tongue in cheek repost regarding the balance of the current raiding content, and its contrast to the “everyone must raid” crap we put up with in the sister release of Wrath IE: Naxx

        I don’t believe my head is in my ass, I just don’t think you should expect a game to be made easy enough for you at its cutting edge. Pugs will kill normals eventually, and that should be good enough for the “people who pay the subs for my raiding”. But those who expect to kill HMs or cutting edge content, or who think luck of the draw or the ICC buff were a good idea are the people who probably shouldn’t be trying to do content which is beyond their capabilities.

        I don’t think it is incorrect to say that if you are not good enough to clear something, you shouldn’t be able to clear it. That is, after all, the definition of a challenge isnt it? If you can’t fail or lose, whats the point?

        Would probably take a chill pill, clearly you’re angry about something.. but I dont see how it relates to my opinion or my post.

  4. Raynor says:

    Feeling exactly same, and quitted wow about a month ago.

    Its really a dead game, IMHO.

    Blizzard not trying to experiment, add some new features, they just keep it running with the new content.

    While WotLK had a lot of really new game-changing features (like achievs, phasing, glyphs, etc), Cataclysm is just a content patch. Nothing really new here.

  5. Vegah says:

    To stop the hit discussion you might put stat weights for Frost DW into your post for “special hit capped but not spell hit capped” (possible due to NoCS) and “spell hit capped but not normal melee hit capped”. That would probably be an effective and easy way to stop discussion by making it obviously pointless. Otherwise there will ALWAYS be someone new coming into the thread and reraising the issue.

    • Grief says:

      or add hit beyond melee special to the stat weights

      both threads still say swordguard is 800AP proc when it was increased to 1000AP awhile ago
      It might be worth updating the AMS section as well

  6. Jhadur says:

    I’ve found myself becoming more and more disinterested in playing WoW lately aswell. It was the same raiding during Wrath but I think most of my interest in the game got burned out during Cata beta.

    I’m starting to find myself not logging in at all save for raid nights and even then its starting to feel like I don’t even want to do that. The longer I’m away from WoW the less I want to play it too.

    Maybe I will get Rift, this open beta week has been interesting even if all the soul speccing possibilities make my brain explode.

    • Faytality says:

      This is exactly how I feel, I am glad I am not the only one that feels this way.

      • ODK says:

        Same Boat, Lazy Guild so i havent even gotten to raid this content, pick a bad guild and other guilds gear up then your just undergeared and not needed by them…no way to catch up without knowing someone or getting a break…. even tho i can outperform others with better gear most the time… so i have absolutely no reason to log into wow, even when i dont have anything else to do and am bored off my ass – wow still sounds borring…. if i had the opportunity to raid, id be happy to do that then log off when it was over most likely….

        i do enjoy solo’ing old content, but im sick and tired of people either not willing to give an alt so once they want to do something you lose the raid and have to start over OR instantly want to come with – but wont go on their own, so they ruin your enjoyment or SLIGHT challenge you find here and there in the dungeons and make it as easy as the rest of the retarted solo play (ease of leveling npc’s and lack of any challenge or change between their mechanics, let alone soloable quests for 5man grps listed as Orange quests)

        bleh, game COULD be amazing, they are slacking like crazy, why? Cause they can…

        once a game finally threatens their playerbase for REAL and long term i think they will actually either put effort forth or just come out with their new MMO

      • ODK says:

        Also – Rifts soul combinations and building is crazy fun to play with so far, wonder how long it will stay fun, but yea, makes my brain wanna explode too just tryin to decide what to do between the 3 souls i already picked heh…

        startin to wonder if single soul or double soul characters would be any good…not sure how many points you get to spend by lvl 50….it seemed like you get an extra point every other level, so id guess around ~75 points maby?

        the rifts are fun but very very repetitive compared to questing or such….specially in the beta when i would only see one or two elements in one zone, end up spending weeks killing the same elementals as if you got a kill 10,000 fire elementals quest….wonder if that will just end up being a mechanic that only entertains the first few weeks then goes stale….

        heard the raid content had no difficulty, 2 tank and spanks and a dont stand in fire check….but with extra promissed endgame content within 30 days of launch….

  7. Dunkelheit says:

    I agree with your thoughts Consider. But I must say, I like getting to this point, where it is either raid or arena that is “left to do”. Esspecially at the beginning of an expansion, WoW can be very time consuming if you are a somewhat ambitious player. There is professions, there is reputation grind, BiS blues and all that. I am really happy that I am now beyond that point, and don’t have that feeling “I have to do this and that” anymore. So I happily just log out or don’t log in.

    Then of course, you might already be in a later stage (boredom), since you have been playing the beta from the beginning, so this Tier is lasting a lot longer for you beta testers then it has for most of us.

    On another note: Updating Stat Weights would be great, since tools like askmrrobot refer to your stat weights for their itterations (Even though priorities probably won’t change.)

  8. Magdalena of Turalyon says:

    The social aspect is also why I currently stick around. Yes, titles and achievements are fun but even without being into Realm Firsts and seeing all HM content before anyone else, the monotony becomes quite unbearable after a while.

    I’m fortunate that I started playing on a rather small server (Dawnbringer) and still have friends there whom I visit and enjoy laughing with frequently (our vent sessions are legendary and would probably have people in fits if we ever recorded them).

    I’ll actually be moving to another server tomorrow to a guild where I’ll hopefully be raiding no more than 8 hours a week, but still be managing to see all content. We’re recruiting an awesome hunter, btw!

    I did want to ask- do you plan to update your EJ threads for every new content patch? I’d understand if the answer was “No”, but it would be a truly shattering loss to the DK community if this was the case.

    Enjoy Rift!

  9. Skellei says:

    I have thoroughly enjoyed playing my DK since very early WOTLK when someone suggested I play through the DK starting zone because it was a great experience. Throughout all the buffs/nerfs/playstyle changes, aside from a respec to frost for leveling 80-85, I have stuck with Unholy the entire way. It’s has been my favorite class to play in any MMO I’ve played, and that list is fairly long. I think those who truly enjoy and understand the class are the ones who have been more successful at adapting to the long list of changes we’ve had to endure.

    I’m more of a lurker than a poster… but I’m making an exception as I just wanted to drop in and say thanks for your contributions to the DK community. Personally I consider myself to be a person who tries and tests things on his own rather than rely on what other people say in a forum or blog. I have probably spent more time on dummies and in sims than I care to admit. But it’s been great to critique my own findings by verifying that they are in line with yours. If nothing else, you have helped me to think and concentrate on the right aspects of gameplay and have led me to conclusions I probably would not have on my own.

    I, too, played the Rift open beta (champion/beastmaster/riftblade) and really enjoyed it. As a father of 3 (12, 10, and 3months), I can only dedicate so much time for my hobbies. I can’t see giving up WoW at this point, since I’ve put so much time into it, and still very much enjoy WoW raid progression and the company of my guildies. Rift was a godsend on offraid nights last week, though… I’ve lost the desire to do a lot of the things I used to do on offraid nights in WOTLK – makings gobs of gold, doing dailies, chasing achievements, leveling alts, etc. Rift, on the other hand, was so new and exciting – to the point where I was having to think again about decisions… making soul choices, examining talent trees, exploring… and there’s so little knowledge posted on the web compared to WoW, it actually forces you to think for yourself.

    My current gameplan will be to sign up for Rift but approach it much more casually than WoW. I will log into WoW for my 3 raid nights a week but spend offnights experiencing Rift. Time will tell if I ever get to a point down the line where I prefer Rift endgame to WoW. That would be a sad day indeed, but it’s probably inevitable.

  10. Trilashand says:

    Rated battlegrounds are where it’s at. It’s like raiding only against other players. It’s a lot more fun then arena or raiding in my opinion, and you can do for hours every day.

  11. Jhadur says:

    So as an aside, any suggestions for a Rift server if I do buy it? Was looking at going Defiant on Wolfsbane if it comes back from beta.

  12. Mr. Tastix says:

    Good to hear from something other than yer Twitter!

    I agree with your points and I, myself, don’t do much other than raiding for old-content achievements of new content. The social aspect is no longer a real issue for me, having lost most of my friends who played the game (yeah, sob story, I know right?).

    The discussion about Frost getting more Hit I thought was very interesting but done horribly wrong. I always stated on the forums (the official ones, that is) that whilst you may look to be getting more dps out of it, it could be a placebo effect: You think you’re getting higher dps so the numbers look higher but haven’t actually altered because of the hit rating.

    I’m not a fan of “real-life raid tests” nor am I a fan of 10 minute target dummy tests. They’re inconsistent, they’re certainly not longer enough when compared to a 5,000 hour test via a simulator. I couldn’t do the latter though as I couldn’t find a working simulator for death knights.

    I’m like you though: I don’t find much outside of raiding/arenas fun anymore. I’m going to play Rift myself, actually, but do you honestly think it’ll be that much different? If you do then I’m going to argue that point.

    It looks different sure, the Soul system is also different but that could be rather difficult to balance. If Blizzard has trouble balancing their game around the different classes for pve and pvp now, how well do you think Trion will do balancing around 96-108 (depending on if you want to add pvp Souls or not) different combinations of Souls and the specs that could come out of those (the specs would be in the nigh millions, much like how hybrid builds were pre-4.0).

    I think it’ll be a decent game, but I don’t think it’s largely different from WoW now (they advertise it as a “next-gen” MMO but that’s a bunch of crap). I’ll enjoy the outside raids and may even a few 20-man instanced raids, barring my PC doesn’t spew acid in my face when I try them, but I think it will end up in the same place as WoW, in regards to end-game.

    • Consider says:

      I do think rifts have a lot of potential to add a more dynamic aspect to the PvE side of the game. Time will tell.

      That said, I don’t think Rift will be all that different from WoW, no. But it doesn’t have to be for me to enjoy it. I’ve thoroughly enjoyed WoW for 6 years, and it’s only now that I’m finding the utter lack of content (outside of raiding) to be a bore. If it takes me even ten percent of that time to reach a similar point in Rift, then it will still have been money well spent. I’m not looking to dive into it, rush to 50 in the smallest amount of /played I can, join the most hardcore guild I can, and so forth. I’m just looking for something fun, nothing more or less, and whatever sort of playstyle or however long/short of a play that may lead to is fine by me. Same approach I took when starting WoW (and god knows I didn’t expect it to turn out how it did in terms of… well, everything).

      • Mr. Tastix says:

        Oh no, don’t get me wrong, I agree completely.

        I’ve only played WoW for half the time you have but frankly, I already see the repetition as rather boring.

        Rift may not feel much different in this regards but I like it because it’s not being designed by Blizzard. That means diversity. If Trion don’t blatantly copy Blizzard in all their decisions but do keep in mind some of Blizzard’s more wiser decisions, then I think that Rift could work out pretty well as something different for ex-WoW players.

        It honestly depends on how creative they get, for me. I’ll still probably play World of Warcraft (mostly for Arena and due to running my own guild) but it’d be nice if there was something unique about raid encounters in Rift, from time to time, in the very least.

        Having something outside of raiding would also be nice.

  13. Beo says:

    Yeah I agree with you. Been playing since 04 myself and the game just keeps losing my interest bit by bit.

    Don’t really know if I will play any more MMO’s though if I quit wow. MIght just stick to LoL and console games. Ever since this over nerf from UH I just find my DK has lost the fun I had at the beginning of Cata. I wasn’t upset being brought down a bit but now watching the Ret pally in my raid do more than I was doing pre nerf just makes me sad and annoyed.

    Thanks for all the info you give us DK’s out here though and all the work you do. Appreciate it all greatly.

  14. Branith says:

    Good post Consider. Ive followed your musings for a while now and I couldnt agree more with this post.

    I quit WoW when my computer finally was able to process Rift back in Beta 3, and havnt looked back since. The social aspect that is keeping you around is why my firends have followed me to Rift we’ve been together for 2 expansions now and im not about to quit on them now. Now that we no longer have to worry about being seperated via games theres no reason for us to continue to play WoW.

    Azeroth is a dead world, the way Bliizard goes about implementing content that is rehash of the same old same old is rather dull, instead of focusing on open world content that has nothing to do with leveling or dailies they focus on instanced and boring. Rift has opened my eyes to what I miss about games like DAoC and Asherons Call, actual breathing living world isntead of glorified chat channels called Stormwind City, Orgrimar, Dalaran, Shattrath etc. I knew from the bottom of my heart that when they axed the original plans for archeology and path of the titans, this would happen.

  15. Madarame says:

    well sir, i am feeling the same. after kicking down all NH raidbosses, grinding all cata reps to exalted, maxing out profs – i also feel the boringness.

    after the recent hotfix nerfs its no more fun for me. i hate to login and do heroic daily. it’s nothing to do.

    well blizzard gave us 2 tiers. yes TWO. NH and HM. well – again. boringness. same encounter – a little harder.

    wow. because of this. blizzard doesnt release new raidcontent as fast as in TBC. They are saying: “”look, here’s tier 11, but with hardmodes you will take longer to finish the content. we have not so much work to do for 2 different tiers w/o hardmodes. so you fool.

    well, that’s my biggest complaint since ICC. I DON’T WANT 2 Difficulties. I WANT 2 TIERS. 2 Different Raids.

    hopefully you understand what i mean. can’t explain that so good in english.

    so i’m out. my addiction now lies with league of legends.

  16. Koori Gamer says:

    I too am feeling in the same boat. I actually switched to my rogue(original Vanilla toon, whom I didn’t touch much in BC / Wrath) soon after hitting 85 on my DK, to switch it up, am now tanking on my DK a lot, no idea what I’ll do next. Wanting to get a better PC so i can go back to LoL and SC2(casual play with mates for both really).

  17. Mysiana says:

    I, too, have been finding that the only thing that keeps bringing me back into WoW is our raiding progression and the social aspect (alts were fun for awhile but I’ve run out of space). I played Rift for the open beta and it was pretty interesting – definitely different. Ignoring those dynamic spawns is the worst thing you can do – next thing you know, they’ve taken over your quest hub and you’ve got nowhere to go! I’ve watched a video of the endgame and it promises to be as intriguing as WoW is, and IMO the PvP is much more interesting. *shrug* I don’t expect to leave WoW, but Rift will definitely take up a lot of my off-raid time.

    @Consider – I would definitely be interested in a Rift write-up, although I think it might be a bit much to chew with concerns to all of the soul combinations for each calling.

  18. Kumduh says:

    Let us know what Rift server you’ll be on (when they release the server names between now and Thursday’s head start)

    If you plan on playing on a pvp server, I might be biased to pick that one. Still waiting to see what some of the other MMO-C mods are gonna pick.

  19. coldazice says:

    Goodbye – I’d appreciate that Rift review of yours – can’t bring myself to try it out since I am kinda on a tight schedule myself and after all those other huge disappointments….,D

    • Branith says:

      Trust me when I say this isnt AoC, WAR, AION or anoy other MMO released in the last 4 years. Rift has its quirks for sure, but once you play and look, and I mean really look into the world, the art, the style and the projected future of the game it all adds up to being on par with WoW in excellence. With time this can get much better. I urge you to try it out and get thru the first 20 levels (which doesnt take more then a day if you’re used to WoW leveling) and you will notice the scope and depth of Rift.

  20. Raaj says:

    Lol, I have not visited your blog in the last week, because I was playing the Rift open beta. I still like my Death Knight class, and I was looking for something similar in Rift. The closest I have been able to come is a Cleric, with my first 12 points in Justicer (for the self/group heals and tank ability).

    I used a 0 point Sentinel for the insta heal in beta, but I plan to use a 0 point Warden in Live at start for the HoT instead, as the 8 sec recast timer on the Sentinel did not allow me to heal friends as much as I would have liked.

    For my third tree I went Inquisitor, because of the insta cast Vex Dot/Life Drain combined with Harsh Discipline for a channeled lifetap.

    All together, I felt like I was playing a wotlk dps blood dk! The only thing I really missed was my 20% increased mount speed from Pale Horse, but as far as I can tell, none of the classes get increased mount speed.

    Anyways, I really enjoyed that combination for leveling, but was thinking about switching Inquisitor to Cabilist in the endgame for the extra ae.

    For those who want to play with it, here is a link to a Rift character builder:

    I look forward to your posts on Rift 🙂

    • Jhadur says:

      For a warrior setup a Riftblade/Reaver spec plays pretty simmer to a DK. There are dots, aoe, some healing, and Reaver is a tank soul. Riftblade has a good number of ranged abilities and snares/roots. It even has an ability called Frost Strike, something I found rather funny.

      • Branith says:

        Yea To get as close to a WoW DK as possible you need to go Rift Blade, Reaver and the 4rd soul for BM for a pet (to replace your ghoul) but this is a pretty gimpy spec or add in a Warlord for group buffs and a Death Grip.

        Cleric can get pretty close to the style of DK as well with Shaman or Druid main spec, Inquisitor as secondary spec and Justicar (for defense) or Sentinel (for heals and an insta nuke and an additional DOT) I msyelf plan on playing Cleric with a Inquisitor main, Justicar 2nd soul and Sentinel for my 3rd soul for a life and death based DoT damage class with off heal support and a very strong main nuke in Bolt of Judgement and Bolt of Depravity.

  21. Jhadur says:

    If I may make suggestions for servers I know at least 6-7 people that are going to play on Keenblade(PvE) and I can convince some of them to roll chars on a PvP server. I figured Reclaimer seems to be in a happy above average number right now and ought to be populated but not as much as Briarcliff and Deepstrike appear to be.

    So what do y’all think of Keenblade PvE and Reclaimer PvP?

  22. Branith says:

    me and my friends are playing on Lotham PvP. We thoughly enjoyed our time there thru all 7 betas.

  23. Majk says:

    Well constructed, intelligent and relevant thoughts, regardless of thier target (as long as its mmorpg’s) are why I avidly read your blog/twitter. So chalk another line up on “people-interested-in-reading-about-anything-I-have-to-say-on-the.subject-of-mmorpgs” column.

    Keep up the exemplary work for humanity’s sake. Please.

  24. Sartharion of Terenas says:

    (Yes, I’ve moved servers)

    Here’s an interesting change to Frost DPS that was datamined from the Patch 4.1 notes (not official, but datamined): Blood of the North now Permanently transforms your Blood Runes into Death Runes. Death Runes count as a Blood, Frost, or Unholy Rune.

    No more need for Blood Strike and a permanent spot for Obliterate/Howling Blast now? Always welcome!

    • Dascylus says:

      Well, it was made official by Blizzard shortly after… probably the most awesome change for Frost I’ve seen. So glad I stuck with the spec, I just hope it doesn’t get nerfed into the ground… though I have played it when it was subpar, so I’d probably still play it if it became subpar again because it’s just such an entertaining spec.

      • Leviatharan says:

        Kinda makes you wonder if there’s even a point for Blood Strike anymore.
        Aside from leveling, of course.

        Probably all for the best; even thinking of Desolation still makes me sick to my stomach.

  25. Dascylus says:

    Oh dear, new patch coming to PTR soon… means Consider is gonna have to do this all over again. (changes to Frost = huge stat weight changes)

  26. Jhadur says:

    It’s funny I, and others, complained about them making abilities useless during beta with outbreak and festering strike making PS and IT a joke but Blizz seems to want to keep on with it. Wish I could say I’d miss Blood Strike but I don’t want to play a 3 button dps class either.

  27. Jayce says:

    I was in the Que for one minute total today. Glad the people I planned to play with were smart enough to have some flexibility and switch servers.

  28. Totally feeling the disinterest. I think a lot of people are feeling it. I’m hoping Bioware introduces some real variety to the MMO field and gives WoW a run for its money because I think Blizzard has been resting on its laurels for the last few years with regards to WoW.

    It’s a money maker, the cash crop, and they’re content to just keep churning out the same old, same old repeatedly. That is, until someone comes along and reminds them why their game was innovative back in the day.

    I’d also mention that updating the leaders, the buildings, the water effects, the water, the enemies, the new races, the armor, the everything, but leaving the NPC’s and your characters at 2004-level graphics is a great way to FEEL like you’re not updating your game.

    I knew when Cata started and people were saying UH was so high, I knew the nerfs were coming and they kept coming. Wave after wave, nerf after nerf, with Blizz not content to leave UH at the top, near the top, or even midway to the top. Not sure I get that.

    But then suddenly I found, I wasn’t sure I cared. I’ve still got a subscription card I’m waiting to use, but so far, they haven’t given me a reason to log in in a while.

    • Jonneh says:

      for lovers of kotor and mass effect, I’m sure SWTOR will at least bring some entertainment.

      Sadly, I have my doubts about its endgame. I think they are placing too much emphasis on its re playability via rolling a new character and seeing the story from a different perspective. Which is great for a single player or co-op game.. but on the MMO playing field there will be a great demand to play endgame with the character that you love.

      Time will tell, I have my fingers crossed!

  29. Dante says:

    Hi guys, I know this might not be the best place to ask this question but it was deleted on EJ forum so…
    Well I take my chance here(even if it’s a bit awkward):

    With the recent nerfs on the Ghoul/Abomination (Unholy), and the BiS weapon as a sword, does the Goblins now overcome Orcs at the absolute best Horde race ?

    Besides, I tried to know it be my-self but both sims (Kahorie’s simulator and SimCraft) don’t look that accurate.
    Furthermore, they don’t give the same answer:
    Kahorie’s sim points out that Orcs are better whereas SimCraft favors Goblins over Orcs…so I’m confused.

    Thanks !

  30. Qaenyin says:

    I’m inclined to agree honestly. The past few expansions I’ve gotten through mostly through luck or content breadth. WotLK had split lockouts on 10/25 mans so if you were in a 25 man guild you could pug 10 mans with competent friends or whatever in your spare time just to dink around on normal mode stuff for fun. TBC I played very little of. Vanilla everything was new so you could ignore a lack of things to do because there was always something you hadn’t done yet.

    Cata in general has a massive dearth of “different” content, it doesn’t have the split lockouts of WotLK nor the faceroll spare time dink around pug raids of Naxx/Kara. It doesn’t have a wide variety of spec customization ability to experiment with new things and just generally goof around, so for theorycrafters imo Cata has made them largely obosolete, to the point where simulators do everything and the only point of sites like EJ these days is to host sims and get information together to build sims, but very little actual discussion on ideas is done compared to Wrath or TBC.

    What with how “on rails” it feels like everything is now I find myself bored of the game if only because even when I raid I feel like I’m just following instructions and there’s no room for improvisation or thinking up new ideas unless you’re literally the top 5 guilds trying to think up strats for fights that don’t have strats yet. I’m a tank for the #1 guild on my server at present and I can’t help feeling obsolete and like thinking about what I do is totally unnecessary, which is a bad direction for the game to have gone in my opinion.

  31. Artholas says:

    So, about the latest posts in the Frost thread. Who’s right, SimCraft or Consider? SimCraft has the secondary stat weightings as Haste > Crit > Mastery, the complete opposite of the OP, and they seem pretty confident about it.

  32. Sartharion of Terenas says:

    @Latest Tweet

    *Hypnotizes Consider*
    You will change your mind, you will change your mind….

    In all seriousness though, it’s quite understandable. I think many people can’t properly appreciate how much time and effort it takes into maintaining threads like the one you’ve developed on EJ; particularly the annoyance associated with a random hotfixes causing you to have to micro-edit it every few days.

    Do you think you might post relevant changes/thoughts on gear, etc, on this blog? Most of your readers likely have a good grasp of DK basics and thus don’t need to be spoonfed minor details. I suppose what most of us will be asking about from patch to patch is stat weights and/or build changes. Everything else should fall into place from there!

  33. Tarciryan says:

    Thanks for the great effort you have done the last years on the EJ forums. Having found Rift amazing myself, I’ve moved on and I have no problem understanding your reasons.

  34. RokuNecrosis says:

    Thank you for everything you have done Consider. You have been very helpful – and I appreciate the time you put in to the EJ threads – and your comments / info here.

  35. Corruptae says:

    Thanks for all the hard work consider. I found your guides on ej and posts here thoughtful and helpful. I hope that you enjoy continued success wherever your path may lead.

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